[1833] Custom Avatar Scalers Broken
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SpaceJackalTim
Custom avatar scalers like the Jackal Scaling System or Mags Scale Adjuster have been broken by the latest beta update. Before the update you could use these to select a custom size multiplier and then reload your avatar to be set to that scale. Usually this would be done by toggling OSC off and on, but just switching out and back into the avatar would usually also work. I have provided a public avatar with the Jackal Scaling System for testing.
Steps to reproduce:
- Use avatar with custom scaler.
- Select any custom size (for example 5x)
- Reload avatar (either toggle OSC off and back on, or switch away and back to the avatar)
- Notice how in the beta your eye height did not change but your body has. Whereas on live the scaler is working fully as intended.
This seems to be caused by a change in how the TPose animator is loaded or handled in the latest beta update.
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Tupper - VRChat Head of Community
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Unfortunately -- and I know this is going to be a pain -- this is a "Won't Fix" for us.
The reason is that these custom scalers use methods we have never supported.
The creators who make these custom scalers know this, and warn buyers on their store pages:
> The scaler uses a workaround to bypass VRChat's restrictions. I can not guarantee that the scaler won't be broken by a future VRChat update.
The creator is correct, and the cited "future VRChat update" is, unfortunately, this one.
If we were to address this issue:
- It would mean we're now supporting something new, a thing which we have explicitly stated previously that we do notsupport.
- It would require us to revert changes meant to improve or fix other parts of VRChat that we dosupport.
- It would require an unknown amount of time from our team to fix this instance of the issue, and even more time to continue to support these currently-unsupported systems.
Unfortunately, we are not willing to make those compromises, so this issue will be closed with a reason of "Will Not Fix."
Again, we know this may be frustrating to see, and we appreciate the feedback that you all are giving us either way. It gives us a good indication of how we might improve Avatar Scaling in the future.
_Valerie
Echoing what other have so elegantly stated. This is a very dear thing that will negatively affect the user experience of many people who enjoy the freedom and expression that comes with the use of these scalers.
I, and many others implore the team to reconsider these changes or see to a work around so that the community that enjoys them may still find a home in VRC.
Tymber
Echoing what others have said here. The ability to change scale beyond the currently defined bounds is integral to my enjoyment and identity when using VRChat, and if that is taken away then I'll be looking for alternatives. I can guarantee you there are many more users that patching out this workaround affects than who would benefit from the current beta bugfix for accessories.
NotYourLynLyn
Dang. I was literally just about to start doing events and introduce more people into the platform, even advocate for age verification, but what's even the point if the interested community can't express themselves? The limitations brought in by this change will mark the end of my time on VRChat, as well as my VRC+ subscription, which I will be canceling if this change makes it to live patches of this game, and I will have to advise AGAINST VRC for any macro content enjoyers, because it would have dropped much of the support that would be required to make it an appealing option.
Of course, this is not the end of our community. The macro/micro community is deeply talented, and if VRC fails, we will likely make our own platform, and it will likely begin to siphon other disgruntled VRC users as other communities are shut down, abandoned, and silenced.
RoflLion
Echoing what other folks have already said, but losing this (even if it's technically an exploit) is a huge downgrade in function for VRC.
Part of what makes VRC special is the openness to let folks do the things they want to do. People create, bond with others, and explore their own identities through this platform. If size is important to someone's identity (like it is for me and MANY others already posting here) then this getting patched without any official support to replicate the behavior is not okay.
BigDashT
We literally have a functional feature that gives us what we want but its restricted to 5 meters for completely arbitrary reasons.
I hope you reconsider this breaking change, there is an entire community who's ability to enjoy VRChat is going to be shot because of this.
If this feature gets removed, im ending my VRC+ sub.
Azaan_Zero
I will keep this brief as I'm essentially just re-iterating what a number of people have said before.
'Going to be a pain' is putting it very lightly. The ability to scale up or down beyond the enforced .2 and 5 meter constrains is integral to my enjoyment of the platform. It's one very important piece of my identity that has allowed me to find a community where I truly feel at home. Without it, my enjoyment of the platform will be greatly diminished and I will no longer be able to justify continuing my monthly subscription to VRC+.
Miamikicchi
I'm really not at all happy with the VRC team response.
To the devs:
The game LITERALLY has a FUNCTIONAL feature for it, yet for some reason devs refuse to allow people to use it to its full extent. Please THINK about the whole situation for a while.
Ekso
Not looking forward to having to upload dozens of nearly identical avatars at different scales again :(
Tyrnn
Good evening. As someone who has been a part of the furry macro/micro community for over 25 years now, I've seen a lot of changes over the years and they've always been for the better. Faster internet speeds, more processing power, better graphics, and finally, FINALLY we have Virtual Reality in our own homes! It's been wonderful and I am truly grateful for all the time, effort, and resources that have gone into making this the perfect place for me to finally feel like I Belong Here. I can Exist as Myself. I haven't felt this Correct since I created my FurryMuck account in 2000, and I don't ever want to lose that feeling of Belonging in an online space. Being able to size shift (Responsibly!) is a core aspect of my identity now and VRChat is definitely the closest I can imagine to actually being a kaiju.
Please do not take away a core part of my identity by removing this functionality.
I will continue to support VRChat with my monthly subscription if you are willing to help us here in the macro/micro community keep our Safe Spaces intact and allow us to call VRChat home.
Zilena
Gonna toss my hat in as well. Losing this would be deeply frustrating and break a lot of things I enjoy, including worlds and the like. Half the fun of VRChat is doing and being things I can't be in real life, and this takes away a sizeable (pun not intended) chunk of that. I sincerely hope some sort of compromise or alternative can be figured out to keep VRChat a fun and enjoyable place for myself and many others.
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