FinalIK Components on Avatars Local-Only
error.mdl
As of build 772, any FinalIK component added to an avatar only works locally. For example, I have an avatar that uses AimIK to aim a gun with my head. It worked prior to 772 and still does locally, but everyone else sees my gun aiming in the default position.
I'm guessing the new networked IK strips all IK components on other players, and not just the ones its syncing.
Log In
jellejurre
Grounders seem to work remotely, right?
Maybe this is still an issue for other components, but GounderIK and LimbIK are commonly used components that work just fine remotely
Tupper - VRChat Head of Community
open
Moving this back to Open due to time since status change.
Due to many factors, we're not likely to support direct usage of FinalIK going forward.
Not the final word, but for the moment this is the status.
Scionzenos
Tupper - VRChat Head of Community: Hey Tupper if you could elaborate for me, does this mean that VRC will not support Final IK at all in the future or just that we should not expect the changes from Networked IK to be fixed? Currently, Final IK can be used quite easily by using constraints as a middle man, can we expect that functionality to stay at least semi-stable?
Kilerbomb
Just finished setting up an avatar with fairly heavy use of FIK, unaware this was a problem, only to find out none of it worked on remote clients. A year after being marked as "in progress" and no fix still. As others have said, Constraints are not a replacement for FIK. Constraints are good at replicating the behavior of Rigid Bodies/Fixed Joints, but FIK can just do so much more.
Scionzenos
Kilerbomb: Constraints are obviously not a replacement, as you said. However, you can get FIK working on an avatar by having the references/targets be gameobjects that are parent constrained to the reference/target you originally wanted.
While this results in a much more complicated hierarchy, you can mimic the functionality of not having to do this type of workaround.
Kilerbomb
Scionzenos: I did attempt this. However for my application this causes jittering, and not having "Fix Transforms" on causes the FIK limb to drift over time, which does not happen without the constraints workaround. Unfortunately that makes it not viable to use FIK in my case.
Scionzenos
Kilerbomb: Keep in mind that constraint jitter is local only. Not arguing against the canny but constraints are the best middle man while this stuff stays broken.
randtheman688
From what i can see, the unity constraints all link to a specified game object and lack the ability to link to the world rotation and position, which is fairly significant compared to the rigid body methods.
The work around would be to have a single Rigidbody linked to the worlds rotation and position and have all other constraints work of that, but then this still has the issue of breaking in avatar worlds that have death ragdoll enabled.
I would love to exclusively use constraints but a lot of the Rigidbodies I use are to lock to the worlds axis and FinalIK would be a very helpful alternative. for now the resource saving of only using one rigidbody max is nice.
I'll come back to this comment if i find anyway to negate the use of rigidbodies altogether.
Scionzenos
randtheman688: Using rigid bodies for world fixed objects means you can suffer from stutter. Lindesu made a prefab and video on how to use constraints for world fixed objects that is very stable:
It uses negative values to basically do the opposite of what you do, keeping it in place.
Tupper - VRChat Head of Community
We're not closing this just yet, but as Eremite pointed out below, our preliminary looks at the native Unity Constraints system show that you can replicate most (if not all) behavior desired from custom FinalIK components at a lower resource cost.
We strongly suggest checking them out! https://docs.unity3d.com/2018.4/Documentation/Manual/Constraints.html
As an additional, somewhat related aside, Constraints also replace most (if not all) behaviors creators were previously using RigidBody "gimmicks", and at a much lower performance cost.
That being said, Constraints are not completely free performance-wise-- so don't go overboard. :)
Raccoonteur
Tupper - VRChat Head of Community: I'm not very familiar with constraints or Final IK, and as far as I know this still works within the game, so this isn't necessarily a feature request or a bug report so much as a request that if you do break Final IK in the future permanently you make sure we have a way to do this first...
There's one really cool feature that Final IK I think you've forgotten which I don't think constraints can replicate: the ability to create limbs which animate through IK and aim for their next target.
Useful for example, in creating spider robots which properly follow the terrain and four legged creatures where the front legs are connected to your legs but the rear legs move as expected and lag when you turn and such.
I don't know what you have planned for Avatars 3.0 but if its Udon for avatars, then maybe this is something that could be done with that instead? That would certainly be cool!
Tupper - VRChat Head of Community
Raccoonteur: From what I understand, using constraints in tandem with FinalIK solves these issues? I've seen a number of custom leg armatures since the release, so it is possible... I just don't personally know how to set it up. 😄 Definitely an advanced creator thing!
Scionzenos
Tupper - VRChat Head of Community: Final IK is still required for IK related things. The main thing that constraints replaced was the things we were doing with rigid bodies, fixed joints, and the VRC IK Follower.
Right now I wouldn't really recommend using Final IK for simple things like moving items around the avatar (gun from hip to hand), or pointing something at something else, but you can't replace the more complicated things like VRIK or the Grounders of Final IK.
Constraints are incredibly nice, but still act as a band-aide to the underlying problem of not being able to directly reference bones in the humanoid armature. Honestly, due to constraints stability, it's not as big of an issue as it used to be.
Eremite
Just as an update for anyone who comes across this, look into Unity's new constraints system as an alternative. I've done some testing and it seems to replace most of the stuff I'd previously used IK for at a much lower CPU cost: https://docs.unity3d.com/Manual/Constraints.html
DoppeIganger
still not fixed after 10 month <3
Nacho Replay
This has been broken for quite sometime now, i have a handful of avatars that use this that are still broken >.>
This is very nice thing to be able to use over R bodies and other more performance expensive stuff.
Any news on a fix? ;-;
sakuraimikoto33
When will it be fixed?
Eremite
Any updates on this? Looks like it's been in progress for nearly 3 months at this point and several releases have flown by.
I assume it's not as easy as not having it remove the VR_IK/FullBody IK/Execution Order scripts?
This has been driving me mad since my main avatar makes use of the IK setup and it's pretty broken when I'm in VR.
Load More
→