[1546] Remove the ban on untrusted URLs in public instances
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Watching videos has been a common activity in VRChat for many players, including those who are used to staying in public instances. After discussing with VRChat players around me, we found ourselves confused by the sudden ban on untrusted URLs, even when it is allowed in the setting menu. You may not be aware that video links from video websites like Bilibili (which is the most watched video platform in our country) cannot be directly resolved by the built-in video player, and watching videos there requires manually resolving it with external websites and resulting in an untrusted URL.
I understand that custom whitelist and no bans on private instances is a workaround for this problem, however:
- we don't expect world creators from worldwide to build a comprehensive list of URLs for this purpose, especially when they are not bothered by the ban themselves.
- we can move to private instances, but public instances are still a very important platform for free communication and in some sense a core experience in this game.
For the above reasons, I hope you can reconsider the ban on the untrusted URLs in public instances, for example, rollback the change, or get a more fine-grained option to allow those URLs in all instances. Otherwise, I hope to hear from you about a real solid reason for the ban, being more specific on the vulnerabilities playing those videos may trigger.
Removing useful functions should not be the primary option for security reasons. I write this post in hope that getting more discussion on this matter will come up with better solution to it so that more users are satisfied. Thank you for your understanding.
(The behavior has been confirmed in game)
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星野nemui
agree!
红酒Serena
agree
邪風AikoNe
right,agree
无声潮落Sekai
agree
Yoonie_R7
agreeeeeee
kimiwabaka
It's unbelievable that LEGAL players pay for ILLEGAL things. We should have right to REPORT ILLEGAL things, not just banned and lose the right of playing normal video，just like we can report some illegal players. And why u think YouTube is the only one legal, really crazy! It's not your job to judge what's right or wrong on URLS, it's your job to improve your game's features. Instead of fighting against the player like Political Correctness, it's better to be good at the game. PLAYERS HAVE EYES TO WATCH SOMETHING, AND HAVE RIGHT TO REPORT SOMETHING! WE CAN DO IT BY OURSELVES!
༦ω江྆ྲ༈柚ིྱ༡凝ྀღ༧
同意�
Vistanz
But as world creators, you can still whitelist them with web portal, also this ban is only applying to public instances, you still can use converter URLs in Friend+ instances. I don't know what's bothering you.
Vistanz
Unless your actual demand is you want to watch/load illegal/insecure things on public instances and without world creators consent.
buzer ~
Vistanz
1) most people are not world creators
2) people want to watch stuff in (group) publics
3) do you really want to bring up the topic of watching "illegal" things at publics while Popcorn Palace exists?
4) I don't want to beg for world creators "consent" to let me load an URL on my own PC. It's not even their business.
PzKpfwVIII-II
Vistanz
AGREE
PzKpfwVIII-II
buzer ~
as far as I know
theres some ILLEGAL THINGS has been played in some public world already.
I think NO world creators want somebodys to do that
in a public instances that says "OWNER:<world creator>"
make they get into legal problems
Vistanz
buzer ~ Most fundamental question: why in public? Don't tell me just because they like to. There are many things that aren't allowed to do in public, just like in real life, internet still governed by laws from countries worldwide. I think this is already a compromise that balances between user convenience and law side.
dqwyy
Vistanz FYI, some events are at public instances. untrusted ≠ illeagal. This bothers us because "we can not play leagal videos at public instances". For example, we can't play videos from Bilibili, which are obviously legal videos.
Since you are concerned about the illeagal stuffs, that's quite easy, just uncheck "allow untrusted urls" (which is OFF by default) at your settings.
In a word, what you need is a "disallow untrusted url in public instance" switch.
buzer ~
Vistanz you mean why people watch stuff in Popcorn Palace in public? Idk ask them. Do you want them to stop?
Vistanz
dqwyy Yeah insecure doesn't mean illegal, but they are usually related.
If you need to organise an event in public, you should choose a place that is capable to do what you want to do. This is not the reason to object adding this feature/restriction.
Vistanz
buzer ~ The point is, they still can watch videos as usual in non-public instances, freely and legally, including F+ ones.
I saw someone mentioned events, but nobody restricts you organising screening events, your friends (and their friends) or anyone in your group can still join you and you still can play any video you want within non-public instances.
That's the reason IDK the point why they
must
do it in public.dqwyy
Vistanz No, they are hardly related. This restriction will make it impossible to play Bilibili videos, while there are
millions of
legal videos on it. As for the illegal videos, they are just a small amoumt. If you are concerned about the (small amount of) illegal videos, you should ask the VRChat official to provide a "ban untrusted urls at public instances" switch, rather than just banning all the untrusted but legal videos.
FYI, most of the Asian players here also anti those illegal videos like you. We just want to play Bilibili videos and other legal videos, just like other players playing the Youtube videos.
Re "If you need to organise an event in public, you should choose a place that is capable to do what you want to do.": Most of the users are not world creators, that's impossible for them to add the whitelist.
Vistanz
dqwyy The point is, non public instances doesn't affected by this restriction, so you still have freedom to play whatever you want in there.
dqwyy
Vistanz As I mentioned before, many events are organized at (group) public instances.
What we want to do is: find a beautiful world → gather people → play videos
We should also have the freedom to play legal videos on public instance.
BTW, "Topaz Chat" is also at the Allowlisted[1]. This service is also totally uncensored. Maybe you should also oppose this risky service?
Bedises, you also have the freedom to disable "allow untrusted urls" at your settings since you don't need it.
Just imagine that someday you could only play Youtube videos at private instances. Yeah Bilibili etc. is as important as Youtube for many Asian/Chinese players.
Vistanz
dqwyy I would say you still can gather people with Friend+ or Group+, is that
must
be in public to watch videos?Yes, Topaz Chat is already trusted, so what's the point here? The restriction is prevents arbitrary servers tracking you or even doing sneaky things on you, that's what "security" parts talks about. Because for non-public instances, the instance owner takes responsibility on the contents, so I would say it is already a compromise; but for public ones, there's no actual owner, so the responsibility on safety is on creators' hand.
If Topaz Chat is risky, VRChat won't put it in global whitelist in the first place. It has already been verified.
dqwyy
Vistanz
As for the events, it makes many senses to organize PUBLIC events at PUBLIC worlds, and PRIVATE events at friends+ worlds. There is no point to oppose a public event.
As for the Topaz Chat, you can stream any illegal videos to it, no audit at all, so it not safe or trusted at all.
We Asian players also care about the illegal stuffs, so as I mentions before, there is a switch to "disable untrusted urls".
Vistanz
dqwyy Sorry I still didn't get it, most of the music events, even publicly advertised and free to access, they still organised in non-public instances. So for your watching video events, what's the difficulty to organise them in non-public instances? I don't see there's any problem to organise a public event in access-restricted instances.
For legality, it is complicated that when you show it in public, that is the content producer's issue. For Topaz Chat parts, I believe they will take action if you try to broadcast something violates their terms of use and someone reports it.
At least, when a site in on the whitelist, it is verified the responsibility on illegal things and it is safe for everyone connecting to it.
dqwyy
Vistanz I don't want to create a barrier to stop people from joining. That's why I make it totally public.
If you say so, maybe it's unnecessary to watch any Youtube videos at public worlds. Obviously that's not true.
BTW, as you mentioned the "responsibility of world creators" above, I suggest that the VRC official could add a switch to "ban untrusted url" for the world creator.
For illegal stuffs at VRChat, such as rasict videos/avatars, we also anti them a lot. I wish the VRChat official can deal with the reports more efficient. I firmly support the right to "disallow untrusted url" by the users and world creators .
Vistanz
dqwyy When an instance is in public, it is already not get controlled by the event organisers, i.e. the location is not "owned" by your event, because everyone even they aren't attending to your event can join or occupy your instance. So I would say your public instances are not meant for your event.
Switching instances are very common in VRChat, I don't think that's a problem either. When you can't watch it, switch to a access restricted instance, just like when you want do/showing something NSFW, which is also not allowed in public instances.
dqwyy
Vistanz I dont need to own or control the instance. I don't need any privilege in the event because I believe that every players are equal. I just need a space to share the videos publicly.
Since people can share Youtube videos at public instances, that's no point to stop players from sharing Bilibili (or other legal platform) videos at public instances.
I fully understand that many players and world creators care about the illegal things, so I would say it again, I highly support the VRChat official provide a switch for the creators to "ban untrusted urls", and also provide a "url blacklist", and also a "user blacklist" to ban trolls who try to play illegal videos.
Vistanz
dqwyy So you mean add the suspicious site when world creator sees it? What if they simply make 10s or 100s more alias afterwards? This just make the whole solution more cats and mouse, does not help the situation.
Therefore I still thinks only allows watch non-whitelisted videos in an access controlled instance is safer.
Everyone can still be equal, regardless of the access level of an instance. You still can do whatever you want to do in non-public ones, additionally with lesser restrictions, not only for URLs you can enter to video players.
dqwyy
Vistanz
No, I don't mean "add the suspicious site when world creator sees it", I mean the world creator can have the option among "Allow all untrusted urls [OR] Allow untrusted urls except thoes at blacklist [OR] Ban all untrusted urls".
Since you are concerned about the safety, I think the "disallow untrusted url" option is what you need.
Vistanz
dqwyy I think in user side, it can split into 2 options, one is killswitch for all, another is specifically for public instances. While I still think this new whitelist is needed, as I also want to load external video clips at specified URL for specific interior effects in my world.
Do you feel good to it?
dqwyy
Vistanz Yes, it is always a good thing to provide splited options to users. Some users need the srtict whitelist scheme, some users need the permissive blacklist scheme, it's a good thing to provide both options for different users.
And also a "user blacklist" for world creators is important. I have seen several specific individuals repeatedly making racist and hateful comments to African people at public instances.
MAOMAOxyz
同意
JohnUmane
hhhhhh
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